Imagine for a moment that a murderer is sentenced to 40 years (which is being generous btw).

If paroled, on average, his/her sentence would be cut in half to 20 years.

If released through mandatory release laws he/she will serve 2/3 of the sentence.

If that doesn’t piss you off, now consider this:
In addition to these early release options many states allow for “A Day For A Day” that means for every day the prisoner behaves himself, he gets a day off of his sentence for “good behavior” (this is in addition to the initial time off the sentence).

Ultimately, that means that In the above mentioned scenario, the murderer who was sentenced to 40 years, could possibly actually only serve 10 years behind bars before he/she is released.

Some states in the US have adapted Truth in Sentencing laws that are supposed to remedy this, but the legislation varies state to state, and many states have no such laws (including mine).

USA Truth in Sentencing Legislation by State
http://nicic.gov/Library/012259

The reason these early release options were originally put in place was to ease prison overcrowding, but what it has created instead is recidivism (the revolving door effect) where the violent criminal who is released, recommits similar crimes and gets cycled back into the prison system therefore overcrowding continues.

So how should we solve prison overcrowding then? How about giving more appropriate (lesser) sentences for nonviolent criminals? Sentencing drug addicts to treatment centers instead of prison? Other nonviolent criminals to house arrest? Legalize marijuana?

…and this topic is just one of many things wrong with our justice system in the US. After reading Sharla and Dubberzz comments on the other thread I felt it fitting to start this one where you are welcome to voice your opinions related to our broken justice system.

I'll address the post later, but I was just watching a documentary that hits on this point in a sort of obscure way.
It's called If a Tree Falls

Life plus 335 years? :/

An imbalance on the scales of justice?

I'm gonna watch it.

sentenced to say 999 years in prison 9as it happens sometimes)

<In addition to these early release options many states allow for &#8220;A Day For A Day&#8221; that means for every day the prisoner behaves himself, he gets a day off of his sentence for &#8220;good behavior&#8221;>

Then they will only have to serve approx 996 years

"chain gangs" LOL
Why not use prisoners for labor? After all, they can work in the prison library, the kitchen etc. to earn money to buy items.
Put em to some real work.
As for my way of thinking, if your sentence is 50 years, then 50 years is what should be served.
Money can be saved if you cut back all the perks prisoners get.
Time to stop molly-coddling criminals, and No, I am not speaking of being inhumane, just supply only the very basics.

> Time to stop molly-coddling criminals, and No, I am not
> speaking of being inhumane, just supply only the very
> basics.

Have you ever been incarcerated?

We do have TIS legislation in Illinois (passed in 1995 effective 1996), but in my opinion the legislation is flawed and ineffective because there are many examples of considerable discrepancies in time served compared to sentence length since. One particular case that I have a personal interest in is from 1998 (after the legislation was introduced) where a murderer was sentenced to 28 years (which I don't feel was enough for taking a life in the first place) but only served 7 years of the sentence.

Im gunna go out on a limb here and suggest mackay was trying to point out that
Prisoners get all sorts of perks, whilst in prison.

They can, (and not limited to) watch tv, earn diplomas/degrees, Ive heard of a couple of cases, where
prisoners were granted permission to get their Skuba Diving licences...the list goes on and on.

See, Prison is meant to be punishment for committing crimes against society/The Public Good.
Upon Incarceration, you give up your rights of a free person. You've got a bed. 3 meals.
and a few frisky room mates. Being put to hard labor whilst you're being cared for on the tax payer dime
is just a bonus to the tax-payer.

As a tax payer and concerned member of the public, I don't see prisoner education necessarily as a perk. I think it it is a good program to reduce the likelihood of paroled prisoners becoming repeat offenders and rather increasing the likelihood of them becoming productive members of society. It is a benefit to society in my view.

Other "perks" like TV time and Rec time help to manage outbreaks of violence.

Though I do agree that there have been some cases of too many comforts given to prisoners. (I don't think it's common)

> As a tax payer and concerned member of the public

I'll hold you to that when i say, Do you suppose its fair, that you, your children, friends and other family,
cant get for example, a law degree, yet a Prisoner, can take your tax dollars,
and get his?

Freedom was taken when they were imprisoned. Anything more than a 5x5 cell, a bed, and 3 meals a day,
is a perk.

A small price to pay.

In a 1997 study, Illinois Department of Corrections researchers found that inmates who leave prison with basic degrees and job training are far less likely to return. A separate study by the Correctional Education Association found education behind bars led to a 29 percent decrease in recidivism. With Corrections estimating the average cost of incarceration at an Illinois prison at $25,000-$64,000, I think it's worth the cost to try to rehabilitate, not just punish criminals especially considering their likely release back into the public. I'd rather them be a better citizen than a better criminal and return to prison, creating more victims and costing taxpayers even more money.

So how far back does that study go? And does it take into account changing times,
technologies and requirements of society?

go back 2000 years, if you committed a crime, depending on the severity, you were killed,
dismembered (thieves and their hands being cut of, for example) thrown in a dungeon,
or made a slave (or entertainment; see things like colosseum)

1000 years? Same thing, we've got slave powered boats, people are still killed for severe crimes,
still slaves roaming around, dungeons are still as workable than ever, still people being dismembered
for theft, or worse, locked in the gallows for all to see and laugh at.

note on the slaves: lots of them were generally released. after such a time as they had WORKED off
their debt (there were more than just POWs btw) but they were not entitled to learn anything other
than the local language. they did as they were told, when they were told.

500-200 years? alright now we've civilized a bit. dungeons still exist in rare places, we've got jails
now. people are killed for severe crime, witches are burnt at the stake (or drowned in a burlap sack)
slaves still exist in many forms, some places still employ dismemberment from hands for theft and such.

last 200 years? Suddenly people with better knowledge on things jump up and down, demanding
more humane ways to deal with criminals.
Tell me, are you content to know that YOUR tax-payer dollars, pay for pedophiles and rapists
to have sex changes too?

Enough with the easy life of prison.

If you commit a crime, and are sent to prison for it, all rights you had as a free person are terminated
upon judgement. It worked 2000 years ago.

Todays modern age, we have to feel a little sympathy for the rapists, let them earn a law degree
so they can clean slate themselves.
FUCK
THAT

I resent you for making me argue on the side for prisoners rights, but there is a reason for the prison reform we've seen over the past 2000 years. In most places, we are past the times when dismemberment, torture, other forms of mutilation, and public executions are accepted, past being judged without trial (although that part of the system is broken as well) and thankfully past witch hunts because that is some scary shit. Prisoners are human beings, therefore deserve humane treatment, including necessary medical treatment (not elective). I'd rather not see murderers and sex offenders be released at all, but that's not the reality of our justice and prison system today. Educating prisoners who will be released provides a benefit to society. If you just lock them up until their sentence is complete, you get he same or worse criminal at release. Providing entertainment or recreational time reduces prison violence and the danger to prison workers and prisoners therefore reducing costs in areas such as insurance, medical treatment, number of guards needed, etc.

many opportunities for rehabilitation once their sentence is done.
Prison is for punishment of a crime.
It's also not the state's or the federal government's responsibility to "babysit" via tv (cable no less) and recreational time.
A condition of parole might be a mandatory program of education/rehab etc.
Just sugestions.

> I resent you for making me argue on the side for prisoners
> rights

See, im not contesting against their rights. Theres the whole " Cruel And Unusual Punishment "
deal that we cant throw at them. This is why there is no slavery, removal of limbs and whatnot
anymore.

But the fact of the matter remains, when you break the law, are judged, and sentenced,
you give up your rights the moment you broke the law. You're not even allowed to vote whilst
in prison.

Bare minimum is what they deserve, and as was also said, rehab/courses after prison, as
mandatory parts of their ' rehabilitation into civilization ' would be far more acceptable,
than being able to get perks many regular law abiding citizens dont get.

> Committing a crime entitles society to strip you of
> ''some'' right for the sake of just punishment, it does
> not take away your status as citizen and much less a human
> being that would be fair game for all kinds of abuse.

some? really? you forget theres laws, upheld (for the most part) Internationally that prevent cruel
and unusual punishment.

So Im not sure where you get that people are being sadistic when they say
if you commit a crime, you deserve to rot in a cell for the duration, at which point, you will be made
to do mandatory rehab.

And if we force them to do hard labor, then it benefits the community (or so it would be assumed)
and a fair portion of tax-payer money can be handed off to a more fitting use.