If you're trying to find the truth, read this: http://ia700202.us.archive.org/13/items/Scientific_Miracles/Scientific_Miracles_in_the_Holy_Quran.pdf

WHAT HAVE YOU GOT TO LOSE?!!!

> WHAT HAVE YOU GOT TO LOSE?!!!

My precious time :) I rather read the brothers Grimm. Those books are better written.

> If you're trying to find the truth, read this:
> http://ia700202.us.archive.org/13/items/Scientific_Miracle
> s/Scientific_Miracles_in_the_Holy_Quran.pdf
>
> WHAT HAVE YOU GOT TO LOSE?!!!

I think you should check with your mom on the creation thing....

Those allegedly "scientific miracles" have been debunked thousands of times.
Click here:
https://www.google.com.au/search?q=scientific+miracles+of+the+quran+debunked&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

I agree there is only one God. I didnt read the link but I noticed it said quran science debunked and honestly Im not sure if u have ever read the quran or not, but we dont need science to debunk it, muhammad did a good job of that on his own.

In fact, not only have I read the holy Qura'an, but I actually memorized the whole Qura'an by heart!

With all due respect, don't you think that your accusation is groundless. I would really appreciate it if you clarify your point and give some evidence to support it!

Well, the scientific miracles stated in the holy Qura'an have proved to be indisputably true, some of which have been discovered only in the last 2 centuries. In fact, such facts have prompted several scientists and even priests to convert to Islam!!! Don't you think that if these facts had been questionable, such highly knowledgeable people who have specialist expertise in these areas and therefore are obviously the most suitably qualified figures who can debunk these facts would have done that already ! Instead, several ones have actually embraced Islam!!! So, what does this tell you?! How on earth would an illiterate person like Muhammad know about such complicated scientific facts, most of which were not even known or discovered at that time, if he had not been a prophet?!

Don't let what you see and hear on the media about Islam put you off. Bear in mind that the western media is mostly dominated by Islam's worst enemies, so don't expect them to be honest or unbiased in the way they portray Islam. Don't be put off by the disgraceful behavior of some people who call themselves Muslim who either have considerably misunderstood and perverted the essence of Islam or completely disregarded its teachings, and therefore by no means such people represent real Islam. Hence, it is unfair to leave Islam to take the rap for their misdeeds. Besides, why do you blame Islam for the mistakes made by its followers?! I don’t see anybody blame Christianity for the incredibly huge number of serial killers who happened to be Christian, nor do I see anybody blaming Judaism for the brutal massacres in Palestine, whereby kids and innocent civilians are killed in cold blood! I am not saying that we should blame them though.

Besides, such misconception about Islam has been refuted by a number of neutral non-Muslim western historians and orientalists who negated such distorted image of Islam. History books are full of events that attest to Islam’s tolerance and peaceful vision. Such indisputable fact is evident in the statements of many neutral and unbiased historians and orientalists. De Lacy O'Leary in 'Islam at the Crossroads,' London, 1923, for example, stated that (History makes it clear, however, that the legend of fanatical Muslims sweeping through the world and forcing Islam at the point of sword upon conquered races is one of the most fantastically absurd myths that historians have ever repeated.) Another interesting statement, among others, was made by James Michener in ‘Islam: The Misunderstood Religion,’ Reader’s Digest, May 1955, pp. 68-70. "No other religion in history spread so rapidly as Islam. The West has widely believed that this surge of religion was made possible by the sword. But no modern scholar accepts this idea, and the Qur’an is explicit in the support of the freedom of conscience." For further similar statements, see the following link:
http://www.cyberistan.org/islamic/quote1.html#note

The facts recorded in the history books fly in the face of this groundless allegation. For example, Islam entered Spain and ruled it for about 800 years and ruled India for about 1000 years, yet Muslims were minority there!!! Had Islam been really spread by sword, Muslim rulers would have forced the people of Spain and India to convert to Islam. History books, however, show that they lived in peace and prosperity and were free to keep and practice their religion, not to mention that they also had the right to keep their churches and temples under Islamic rule. let’s cut to the chase and pose the most pertinent question. If Islam had really been spread by sword, then don’t you think that this begs the question of (which sword are Muslims using today to spread Islam amongst Americans, British, Germans, etc all over the world)?

(((Another noteworthy point that should be taken into account is the fact that the Islamic world is like any other society we have known in history; you might say it has the good, the bad and the ugly. The extremists, however, are a very small minority and that most Muslims adhere to principles in the Koran that teach peace and tolerance. The media, however, happened to focus only on the extremists and portray them as representative of what Islam is!)))

Regards,

> In fact, not only have I read the holy Qura'an, but I
> actually memorized the whole Qura'an by heart!

really?

Verses = 6,236
Chapters = 114
Books = 30

Unless of course you mean you memorized just the parts that are usually taught
more than the others, which cuts those numbers down quite significantly.

but one book, usually divided into 30 parts for the sake of simplification.

The so-called "Islamic" science, mathematics etc of the middle ages was derived from the Greeks, Persians, Hindus and other civilized peoples conquered by the primitive desert savages of Arabia in the 7/8th centuries.

It appears you have a problem accepting that what you put down as fact isn't accepted as fact by people outside of Islam.

I posted a few links for you. Did you read any of them? Of course not.

> but one book, usually divided into 30 parts for the sake
> of simplification.

lord of the rings was divided into 12 parts, but still called 1 book too,
doesnt change the fact its still 12 books that make up a greater whole,
wasnt for simplification, was for ease of transport since a SINGLE book
was like carrying a cinder block around.

Yes I did. Why is it so surprising to you?! In fact, we even have kids who are like 10 years or younger who memorized the whole holy Qura'an by heart and they recite it much better than I do !

I did download the book and will read it sometime. But honestly, if you are really looking for 'truth', then better come out of all these things that differentiate people.

Well the division into 30 juz's (parts), like the one of 60 hizbs, other further subdivisions or plain pagination, is only a mathematically thought division. Oftentimes it cuts in the middle of a chapter or in grammatically unfinished prose. In this sense the thirty parts are not as separable as the Biblical or the LOTR books. They are mere intext or marginal indications of the reader's progress.

Also, for ease of transport the 600 pages of the Quran have been compiled into pocket book format for centuries. Opting for as many as thirty 20-page booklets instead would hardly be considered handier for the reader, or compare to the division of the LOTR works into several ample volumes...

Dear Nissy,

Obviously you didn't read my previous reply as it answers some of the issues raised by you.

It's perfectly understandable the way we react to anyone or anything that conflicts with what we have believed in throughout our entire life, or conflicts with the picture we've built up about a certain issue, which is unfortunately mostly based on the media. You should bear in mind, however, that media coverage can be very misleading as it is naive to think that it is always impartial, especially considering that Western media is mostly dominated by Islam's worst enemies, so don't expect them to be unbiased and honest in the way they portray Islam.

If you just want to follow the crowd and blindly deny this, then you probably won’t read the 2 links I posted earlier, but don’t you think that any defendant, no matter what his crime is, has the right to be given the chance to defend himself?!! Don’t you think that you should first know everything about the defendant and the case in question before you can justly deliver a guilty verdict?!!! If you decide to listen to reason and enlighten yourself about this issue before you can justly point any fingers then, I strongly emphasize the importance of verifying the credibility of the source from where you get your information about Islam. Another point that I also wish to emphasize is that if you decide to learn more about Islam, make sure to avoid what is known as Shea'a. Actually, I don't know if such people can be called Muslims because they have a gross violation to the essence of Islam. Sunnah, on the other hand, represents the real Islam and follows the real teachings of Prophet Mohammad peace be upon him.

Hence, I suggest you read the 2 links I posted and my earlier response before you jump to conclusions based on media coverage or what you learned from one side only. As for what you said about " the Qura'a scientific miracles" having been debunked, I really hate to repeat myself as I made it already clear in my previous response that several non-Arab priests and scientists have actually converted to Islam after they had found out about these indisputable scientific information, many of whom actually blamed Muslims for not spreading the word about this. Please read my previous response and the links for more information about this.

Quote from my previous response:

(((In fact, such facts have prompted several scientists and even priests to convert to Islam!!! Don't you think that if these facts had been questionable, such highly knowledgeable people who have specialist expertise in these areas and therefore are obviously the most suitably qualified figures who can debunk these facts would have done that already ! Instead, several ones have actually embraced Islam!!! So, what does this tell you?! How on earth would an illiterate person like Muhammad know about such complicated scientific information, most of which were not even known or discovered at that time, if he had not been a prophet?!))) You can find the names of many non-Arab scientists and priests who converted to Islam online.

Regards,

Dear Silverdew,

I assure you this is not my intention at all. I don't mean to differentiate people, and I am terribly sorry if you perceived it this way.

Regards,

Sorry for any inconvenience, but if the topic bothers you that much, you don't have to read it!

regards,

You talk about the media being biased but you fail to see you yourself are. Then you speak of academics joining the islam faith yet fail to see there are many academics ¹ who believe the Christian, Catholic, Agnostic, Atheist, Buddhism etc is the most 'reasonable and logical way of displaying their faith. Every religion, belief, maintains its the ONLY TRUE religion/belief. There maybe only one God but there are many pathways to having a relationship with him/her/it

I didn't mean you intended to differentiate people. I said if u r really looking for 'truth', then better come out of(see things beyond) 'things' that differentiate people like religion/race/etc ;)

why would i block everything 'non-athiest' ? Ive always maintained the view you can believe
what you like, I just like arguing the points. Does religion not teach you to question everything?

> Another
> point that I also wish to emphasize is that if you decide
> to learn more about Islam, make sure to avoid what is
> known as ''Shea'a''. Actually, I don't know if such people
> can be called Muslims because they have a gross violation
> to the essence of Islam. ''Sunnah'', on the other hand,
> represents the real Islam and follows the real teachings
> of Prophet Mohammad peace be upon him.

You call the media biased, but this quote of yours is just as biased. And the difference between Shea'a And Sunnah Islam doesn't make it easier for Westerners to understand what you're talking about.

There is no "true Islam" for there is no one "true religion". If you get down to it on a personal level, not a whole lot of people would exactly have the same opinion about anything, unless they've been influenced by (here it is again) the media, a priest or a imam, or even family.

This is exactly why I stay the hell away from temples, churches or mosques, because organised religion couldn't be further away from spirituality, in my humble opinion.

This doesn't mean I have a negative view on any organised religion; if people want to get together and follow what so called wise leaders spoonfeed them, all the power to them. However, I don't like anyone, coming at my door, bothering me outside or coming online claiming that what they believe is "the truth" and telling whoever's willing to listen that their beliefs are wrong.